> Now if that means RAM prices come down (as speculated, not reported on, in the link) or the AI companies just do more things with their extra ram is yet to be determined.

I think it is determined:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox

Also, there is zero reason to think that the big labs did not have anything similar to TurboQuant for a long time already.

The recent blog post from Google announcing TurboQuant does not change anything regarding RAM planning for the big labs.

TurboQuant itself is already a year old! So even smaller labs have probably seen and implemented it.

I’m not disagreeing with you, but consumer RAM prices are lagging indicators. If commercial RAM prices are dropping then consumers will see those price drops last, especially given the fact that several consumer manufacturers turned to commercial only.

> almost as bad as when LLMs link things to prove their point, you visit the link, and find it says nothing of the sort or even the opposite

To be fair, they got it from us. This happened to me plenty of times long before modern LLMs.

I agree. The article they link to talks about memory company stocks crashing, not RAM prices crashing. There is some truth to the former: https://www.ft.com/content/e4e15692-187e-4466-832e-ec267e792...

I do wonder how closely prices consumer RAM kits follow the wholesale prices for NAND chips manufacturers see internally. The pcpartpicker graphs you linked show consumer prices have leveled out and may even be starting to fall. Depending on how the economics shake out this could mean we've hit an inflection point.

My personal prediction is that once the VC bill comes due and prices for frontier models starts to climb, competition for efficiency will heat up. The main AI use-cases seem to be falling into buckets, and I doubt serving gigantic, do-it-all general models for every use-case under the sun is remotely cost-effective.

If common use-cases start to be more efficiently served by smaller, more efficient purpose-built models (or systems thereof), it'd make the big frontier models increasingly niche. Cursor's Composer 2 model is a great example of this.

In any case, I think it's pretty fair to speculate we may be seeing RAM prices start falling sooner rather than later.

RAM prices haven't crashed yet and it'll take time because it has to propagate within the supply chain. Micron is -20% from the top already https://www.investing.com/equities/micron-tech

Stock price is the best forward indicator I can think of

Even worse, 3 memory companies control well over 90% of the international market, with a history of cartel collaboration that's going to be ever harder to prove with fewer companies.

Some also argue that the RAM price keeps rising because of the bullwhip effect. I was wondering if there's anyway for us to differentiate a sustained demand from the bullwhip effect.

Thank you, there are two things I would like to point out:

1) Google releasing something probably means they don't see it as important. 4-bit KV-cache quantization has been known for a long time. The fact there is almost a mass hysteria about this paper makes me think there is a lack of skepticism in this AI mania, even in relatively tech-savvy crowd.

2) But prices for memory companies are crashing! look around, the whole market is crashing.

I would think that we are going to see RAM prices increase even more, given, among other things, pure helium disruptions and increased electricity prices.

I haven't looked closely into TurboQuant, but perhaps it will revolutionize just as much as the 1-bit llm did...

Even if TurboQuant, which was released a year ago, drastically lower RAM requirements, AI labs will just release bigger models.

Jevons Paradox. When are we going to learn that efficiency gains in AI does not decrease hardware usage?

consumer ram is starved by production capacity shifting to HBMs. Hbms dropping in price would not affect consumer RAM on any immediate timeline. Also, as pointed out by many, Jevons Paradox

> > RAM prices are crashing because new models won’t need as much

> Reality begs to differ [0] and following the link for that text goes to an article [1] where they talk about Google's TurboQuant which supposedly will lower the RAM requirements. Now if that means RAM prices come down (as speculated, not reported on, in the link) or the AI companies just do more things with their extra ram is yet to be determined. The fact this article links there with text "RAM prices are crashing" throws the entire rest of the article into doubt for me.

I find it fascinating how extremely reactive things have become. One research paper which, to my knowledge, hasn't been externally replicated yet, nor implemented, generate tons of hyperbolic article, tweets and such, and do actually manage to move the market at least temporarily. Not just this, but a simple message in full caps lock by the president of the U.S who is in the habit of lying through is teeth constantly, and the same thing happens. It's like there is a big bubble that threw any form of critical thinking out of the window and is in a hurry to react to anything even if it is not even remotely believable. Now I understand why it happens, there is a lot of money that can be made by capitalizing on FOMO, either by driving traffic to their website, socials, etc, or by simply insider trading (which feels like it has been legalized these days). But I still find it incredible the proportion it started to take.

If the gains are real why the limits are so bad? Google can barely serve Anti-gravity.

> Reality begs to differ

Honestly you're both wrong. RAM prices spiked speculatively, and they're going down for the same reason. Market people always want to argue in fundamentals, when in practice *ALL* the high frequency components of the signal are down to a bunch of traders trying to guess where it's going in the short term.

At best those guesses are informed by ground truth ("AI needs a lot of RAM!" "Sam cornered the marked!" "TurboQuant needs less RAM!"), but they remain guesses, and even then you can't tell the difference between that and random motion.

Not crashing yet. The article is looking 1 to 5 years to come.

Given Nvidia's CEO's agitation I would give credit to the prediction, and if it's correct the price will go back to what it was, or even lower of investment in capacity are made today.

Yeah, I also stopped reading at that point. If I want a bunch of random, made up facts to sell lukewarm opinions or steer the uneducated masses, I'll tune in on a Trump press conference. Why does this feel like someone is desperately trying to make reality mirror his flailing market bets?

This feels similar to when Deepseek first debuted with claims of ultra-low cost training, and all the pundits exclaimed that Nvidia was finished, the bubble had burst, etc.

There is also demand for ram in others areas of data centers. As we are all pushed deeper into clouds, i can see the rise of ram for data storage (ram drives) continue to eat into the supply. A module of ddr5 will be more useful in a netflix rack streaming movies 24/7 than in a gaming PC where it may only be used an hour or two every day.