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mrngldyesterday at 11:35 AM4 repliesview on HN

Eaaaaasy now, the Chinese labs aren't freedom fighters on behalf the common man. They're not non-profits, they're not neutral transnational organizations only dedicated to open source efforts.

They're Chinese companies offering open source models now as loss leaders to keep themselves in the game because they know virtually nobody, especially in the corporate world, would contract with them and give them access to their data. They might as well just send a Dropbox link of all their sensitive data directly to their Chinese competitors, same end effect.

They're also doing it as the digital equivalent of what they've done in other industrial sectors for decades. Undercut and flood the market and once you've killed or severely hindered your competition, then you have the market cornered. The moment they can afford to these open source releases will stop.

Then the world will be stuck, just the way the world is largely stuck on rare earths. Instead of being able to regulate the leading companies from DC and Brussels, they'll be stuck watching Beijing call the shots.

That world would likely always have guys like Mistral and Trinity, but it's an open question if they'll ever catch up to the frontier.

And then Beijing will enjoy access to the data (ask any multinational operating in China for more than 2 seconds how useful contracts and Chinas legal system is for protecting IP), and these companies will roll in the money, and the Chinese supply chain will grow up behind the labs.

So, let's not pretend they've got the moral high ground. No. That boot just isn't on your neck yet. They're playing the long game -- and they're good at it.


Replies

binary0010yesterday at 12:47 PM

I think most of us know why they're doing it. We are just very pleased with it regardless.

1. I get great products for nearly free 2. Anthropic/openai/etc will hopefully be destroyed since they stole everyone's work and are trying to capitalize on pure theft.

Win-win. The why of it is not really that relevant.

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HarHarVeryFunnyyesterday at 12:38 PM

The Chinese companies don't have to be open weights, and it's not all about competing with the west. For example, most of Ziphu's (GLM) business in China is supporting private on-prem instances rather than selling API access. They make money by selling support services - much like RedHat's busines model.

idiotsecantyesterday at 11:42 AM

It doesn't matter why Chinese firms are stealing models and open sourcing them. The fact that they are doing it is a very, very good thing for basically everyone other than the people who paid to build the original models, but I've got no sympathy for them considering they stole all the content to train them in the first place. This is some kind of beautiful irony.

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zobzuyesterday at 2:25 PM

you dont get it - usa is the goliath in all scenarios online. these are us based companies. most of the world would like to see them and the us fail.