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grapheneostoday at 12:54 AM10 repliesview on HN

They stopped pushing tags for any of the Pixel kernel or userspace driver repositories to AOSP. They also stopped pushing AOSP releases specific to Pixels which is why AOSP now only gets yearly releases, QPR2 releases and security backports to both of those. Other OEMs use the yearly and theoretically also the QPR2 releases. Both the yearly and QPR2 releases get monthly security backports. Since they dropped Pixel support from AOSP, they don't push the releases not shipped by other OEMs anymore.

These changes directly led to our Motorola partnership. One of their security people reached out to us after seeing our posts about this with the launch of Android 16. We haven't talked about it much since then since we adapted to it during the several weeks it delayed our Android 16 port. We then continued adapting to it and have fully worked around it. It was an ongoing problem but not a new one and we had accepted we had to deal with it as the new normal.

They were previously responding to our kernel source requests within a day. It was often done without hours. Despite the archaic system, this part wasn't that bad. Recently, they've been taking weeks or longer to get back to us for the requests which is ridiculous. It's the direct result of purposely adding a lot of friction with manual handling of the requests even if the delays weren't directly planned by management.

Weeks or months of delay is not reasonable for one of the largest tech companies in the world. GPL doesn't set a standard time limit for providing the sources, but that doesn't mean they can delay it indefinitely. They need to do it in a reasonable amount of time. What's reasonable for one of the largest tech companies in the world in 2026 with current technology is not the same as what was reasonable 30 years ago. Google chose to come up with a archaic way of distributing the sources involving someone manually going through a list and sharing Google Drive access. It's a deliberate way of making it painful. If they can't keep up with it and it gets delayed for weeks or months then they're not complying with the GPL by not providing it in a reasonable amount of time. Law is not code and a time limit not being explicitly written down doesn't mean there isn't a limit to what's reasonable for compliance.

They'll sell far fewer Pixels because of these overall changes. It pushes GrapheneOS and other projects towards other devices instead. For us, Pixels are being used due to security rather than ease of supporting them. It's now a lot harder to deal with Pixels than it would be for many other devices but they're currently still the most secure option. We're working on changing that and have a lot less reason to contribute to improving Pixels. We helped them fix serious security weaknesses for Pixels including vulnerabilities being exploited in the wild by forensic data extraction companies. Pixel security with the stock OS would be worse without GrapheneOS.


Replies

pjmlptoday at 10:02 AM

Well, it is only a matter of luck and internal politics, that Linux kernel hasn't yet been replaced by Zircon on AOSP, which is I guess the only GPL piece that is left from the original 1.0 version.

sphtoday at 10:45 AM

This comment has convinced me to switch from iOS to GrapheneOS for my next phone. Thank you for all your hard work.

chinathrowtoday at 6:53 AM

> They need to do it in a reasonable amount of time.

If they did that for years within hours and if we look at the tools available today, I would expect that "reasonable" equates to how they provided it prior: fast.

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steve1977today at 6:27 AM

> GPL doesn't set a standard time limit for providing the sources, but that doesn't mean they can delay it indefinitely.

I wonder actually what a court would say here and if "doesn't set a time limit" could mean "the source needs to be made available immediately". IANAL.

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matheusmoreiratoday at 7:45 AM

Thanks for GrapheneOS, and shame on Google.

> They'll sell far fewer Pixels because of these overall changes.

They don't even sell Pixels internationally. Can't tell you how glad I am you're moving to Motorola. I'm really looking forward to having a Motorola GrapheneOS phone!!

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bdhdhduuydtoday at 10:25 AM

First of all; thanks for working on GrapheneOS!

2 questions:

  - How hard is it for manufacturers to include the option Android/Graphene just like they have memory and storage options?

  - Could this be a point where GrapheneOS disconnects from Android and become an independent OS?
khimarostoday at 5:40 AM

i have owned nearly every Google phone since the G1. i will not be purchasing any future devices from them unless they change course.

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QuantumNomad_today at 6:41 AM

> They'll sell far fewer Pixels because of these overall changes. It pushes GrapheneOS and other projects towards other devices instead. For us, Pixels are being used due to security rather than ease of supporting them. It's now a lot harder to deal with Pixels than it would be for many other devices but they're currently still the most secure option. We're working on changing that and have a lot less reason to contribute to improving Pixels.

Which brand and model is currently best supported by GrapheneOS, if I want to buy an Android device to run GrapheneOS on?

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rob74today at 6:37 AM

Well, it's as you wrote: they are making the source available, albeit in a very inconvenient way, and because there is no time limit specified, they're complying with the letter of the GPL (although not with its spirit), so you can't even realistically sue them. And the number of people who buy new Pixels to immediately install GrapheneOS on them is (no offense) negligible, so I don't think they'll see a sales impact from it...

Which is not to say that I'm on Google's side, this is absolutely a dick move from them, and they wouldn't have done it 20 or even 10 years ago, but today's Google is definitely no longer the "don't be evil" company.

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poulpy123today at 8:37 AM

I really cross my fingers your partnership with Motorola will be successful