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zdragnaryesterday at 2:08 AM3 repliesview on HN

These programs exist, but they are underutilized to a significant degree.

From a partner who used to work in one, people:

- didn't trust the program and wouldn't sign up

- didn't actually want to quit using so they avoided it

- wanted to get the benefits from the program without changing anything (i.e. showed up to get free food etc)

- tried but didn't like it and went back to using

Very few people actually went all the way through compared to the population in the city that could have used it.

The real question is: how do you help people who do not want your help. Do you let them waste away and die on the sidewalk, or do you institutionalize them?


Replies

Loughlayesterday at 3:04 AM

The answer to that question in a society that allows (mostly) autonomy of choice is that we let them die on the street.

I'm not convinced that involuntary incarceration will actually fix the problem. I believe it will just take it off of the streets and out of the public consciousness.

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KingMachiavellitoday at 12:54 AM

Frankly, I think we need to bring back corporal punishment for specific crimes. The process to arrest, prosecute, and then imprison people for "public space crimes" is basically flawed.

Arresting and prosecuting is slow and expensive, prisons are full. A prison sentence destroys whatever remaining support system a person has and a conviction like that makes getting a job in the future nearly impossible.

We should just have a quick path to short and non-damaging corporal punishment. A quick video recording, an instant review by a judge via zoom, then immediate punishment. This would deter theft, damaging public property, etc. while not costing a lot to taxpayers and not causing long term damage to the individual. Crime is never on the record at all so does not affect background checks. Treatment programs are always offered instead of the corporal punishment.

(Of course mental health conditions complicate this, it's difficult to solve that without forced institutionalizing them).

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convolvatronyesterday at 5:48 PM

maybe the problem here is the gate that requires them to quit cold turkey before offering them any help? I know it offends people morally to 'subsidize drug use', but that's a really high barrier for an opioid or crank addict to meet. the other issues are that people complain that its very prison like, in terms of the volume and severity of rules. the other really unfortunate thing is that some fraction of the homeless population is _really nasty_. so no one really wants to get locked up with these people.

but to say that the majority of them don't want any help is just wrong.