alt Hacker NewsiPhone Duo
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These threads are often amusing with people obliviously asking: why doesn't Apple make exactly what I want? And then stating with certainty how well their custom requirements would sell.
I'll probably wait and see how this phone does over the next few years. If it is still highly regarded by version 3 then I could imagine making the switch to a folding phone. For now I will remain conservative since my phone is such a critical piece of tech.
As a recent Android foldable phone owner (Google Pixel), I'm excited that the Duo will get developers to actually design apps for foldables. Right now, some apps don't work at all and others are just stretched. I feel a better use of the screen space is around the corner for both Android foldable and Duo users.
I don't think I would want this device for $500, let alone what Apple is asking.
What is the appeal? There are a few screen scenarios that make sense for my life: (1) Multiple displays at desk to work; (2) TV + couch; (3) laptop + lap or surface; (4) phone (anywhere). I'm never in need of a tablet. If I needed that screen real estate, I'd be reaching for my laptop.
I am 75, and have a ton of computer gear. I can imagine myself as an old man later in life, not wanting to do any programming, and just wanting a single digital device like a future version of this product. Let’s see what Apple has available in 10 years.
Foldables seem like Homer's car to me. It's a worse phone and a worse tablet all in one.
For reference:
https://media.wired.com/photos/593252a1edfced5820d0fa07/3:2/...
I'll give John Ternus credit: the demos are interesting and fun.
Maybe not $2k fun + inherent risk with buying the first generation of an Apple product particularly after the Apple Vision Pro, but still.
A lot of stuff showing its folding allowing you to "use it as a bedtime clock" - have apple done any kind if battery use trickery to make this a non-battery-draining thing to do? Or maybe I'm overestimating how much battery a screen uses? (I'd have thought a lot)
We keep putting more powerful chips into phones, and giving them bigger screens, but we never turn them into useful computers. Why is this?
$2K starting price is rough. I’ve upgraded my iPhone every year since my first phone, the 3GS. It’s one of a few “splurge”-type things I allow myself. It’s a hobby and just fun to play with the new hotness. This year might break the cycle.
I don’t care for the 18 Pro colors, I still love my orange 17 Pro, and I’m not sold on the Duo (functionality or price).
I might still end up with a Duo but I’m very much on the fence. I’ll tell myself it’s for development/testing reasons, or just to play with the newest offering but I’m just not sure. I worry this will suffer from the same lack of developer interest as the AVP did. Yes, it’s very different from the AVP and SwiftUI will almost certainly make this process easier but I’m still not sure.
I think the use case here is for people who have an iPhone as well as an iPad they use occasionally for reading/watching stuff, as well as business people / execs.
Now you can (sort of) have both in one device. Reading the rumours, I was completely disinterested. Now I’m actually tempting to ditch the iPad Pro and iPhone Pro and have a Duo replace both. I’m excited to have a go with one in the Apple Store.
Shame it’s so damn expensive!
I've had two folding phones and I am not going back until the issues are resolved. Here were my problems:
1. After a while, I think dust would inevitably get in the hinges and wouldn't fold flat. I've seen demos in stores of newer gen Samsung foldable phones and it looks like those wouldn't fold flat
2. The inner screen protector eventually lifted off the screen, causing catastrophic damage, and requiring repair (under warranty thankfully)
3. The aspect ratios were weird. I ended up using native app sizes, making the extra space kind of a waste
One thing I did like about the Samsung foldables was that when they were folded and using the front screen, I finally had a phone that fit my smaller hands! It was nice being able to use my thumb to reach the other side of the screen. Will be interesting to see how this works out because it looks decidedly wider.
I’m a bit shocked for the design of the folio cover for iPhone duo.
1) it seems that doesn’t permit to add some mag safe accessories like extra battery or wallet with cards
2) I don’t understand if with this cover on, the first screen is not usable at all or permits to access to the “external” smaller screen
I understand that this kind of design obviously obligates to some constraints, but I think what Steve would have decided in such situation.
I hope that we don’t fall again in the Performa epoch in which we had a lot of different Mac and designs under the same line
Genuinely bonkers. I never thought they’d do this. Just seems so like a Xiaomi Xi7 Super Max Fold Z or something. But I have to say that when I used one of those Android folding phones it was quite cool to end up with a big screen in your pocket.
Just didn’t feel it was an Appleish product.
- It works with the pencil! This is a big big deal. I can do whiteboarding with customers quickly without having to break out a separate device, for example. Definitely unfortunate for the reMarkable Move and devices like that.
- They actually might have nailed the hinge and crease problems.
- I've been excited for this release ever since the rumor of the iPhone Air being a prototype of sorts for this came out. Two iPhone Airs fit very comfortably in my hip pack (though I only ever have one at a time).
There’s a standard for paper sizes called the ISO 216 international standard, aka A-series paper sizes. You may be familiar with it outside of the American 8.5”x11” letter size. The simplicity, for example, where an A3 sheet is exactly twice the area of A4. One A3 sheet folded in half becomes two A4 sheets. This is intentional: when you fold or divide an A-series sheet exactly in half, the resulting sheets have the same proportions as the prior. The aspect ratio is preserved across all A-series paper sizes.
The iPhone Duo is designed with this in mind. The aspect ratio any way you view it, folded or open, is preserved. Apple design knows a thing or two.
Trying to figure out what demographic this is for and I'm coming up empty. Any ideas?
It's too small to replace my ipad, too big to replace my phone. Seems too fragile for kids, plus they don't need that. Maybe it's good for the elderly?
Contrary to earlier rumours the Iphone Duo will support magsafe:
To be honest a flip smartphone with three screens so one screen is always out is a bad design decision. The best thing on a flip smartphone is that it’s protect the screen cause they are inside. On this model I need a protection case, too.
On the other side I have to decide to want a big screen or a very good camera - ths sucks, too. I want one device which is high end and don’t want to make compromises at this price tag.
Apple is simply repeating Samsung, Google and the other companies with their Duo model. Nothing revolutional, nothing "one more thing amazing". Another heavy and clunky foldable phone. I bet that folding durability will disappoint the users after all.
Apple killed the iPhone mini because it only had a 4-6% share of sales of all iPhone models. While some people may really want this, I can't imaging that it'll get more than 5% of iPhone sales (after maybe an initial higher novelty peak).
A bit over a year ago I got an iPad Pro with the nano-texture display and when hearing that apple was developing a folding phone I thought, man, if they put this screen on the inner display that would be amazing.
I assumed they wouldn't do it because they were marketing the nano-texture as a specialty thing for professionals and glossy screens were the popular ones, but now here we are.
After four years of watching the JerryRigEverything YouTube channel snap Google's foldable phones in half at the same spot along the antenna lines, I'm looking forward to seeing how well this holds up.
Something this expensive should not be that fragile year after year.
Oh thanks but I need less screen in my life, not more.
Why do they insist on every new phone being bigger than the phones before them?
I don't mind folding. I think it's cool, and a nice way to get a useful space. But I have big hands, and I can't use my iphone 17 now without two hands. This is even wider before unfolding.
Who wants bigger phones? Who is like, "damn I wish I had a tablet that I could fold up and still barely fit in my pocket"?
I want smaller phones. The width of the iPhone 4 was nearly perfect imo. If they would take modern display technology with approximately that width and expand it to 16:9, I think it would kill, even if it were relatively underpowered compared to the modern top of the line.
It felt very "un-Apple" when they called it a foldable phone _before_ revealing it.
The folding part is the thing the tech journalists say; done right, it shouldn't matter whether it's foldable or not.
Bigger screen, pencil support, nano-glass, etc. The foldable part is obvious, why say it?
One thing I love about metric paper is the beauty of the simplicity: When you fold it, it maintains its ratio. This is because it is 1:1.41, aka 1:sqrt(2)
When I saw that this new phone is 1:1.4, I instantly appreciated why it is that way. Metric paper wins again!
The people at Microsoft who made the Surface Duo must be feeling pretty weird seeing this. The name, the aspect ratio, the way the UI works, the gestures for setting up split-screen, the "use it as a tiny laptop" mode... It's all things they pioneered.
Not that that's a bad thing. I absolutely loved the Surface Duo, it was my favorite phone until it stopped working correctly, and I hope other Android manufacturers take note of this, not just Samsung. It's just wild to see how similar this new Duo is to the original Duo.
Will be interesting to see what these look like in an Apple Store after a few months of people handling them. Seeing the creases and crunchy-feeling hinges on well-used Samsung Fold display models has always been enough to put me off wanting one.
It's priced identical to the Samsung Fold 8.
The dimensions are also close.
From a visual aesthetics perspective, I prefer the square edges of the Samsung Fold 8.
Eager to check out the reviews of the software capabilities of the iPhone Duo.
And I'm not sure about the inner screen's selfie camera. The under-screen camera has failed in previous devices, especially for zoom calls, it was abysmal.
Excited for the nano texture displays though. For far too long, Samsung had beaten Apple with non-reflective displays.
Why do they insist on every new phone being bigger than the phones before them? I don't mind folding. I think it's cool, and a nice way to get a useful space. But I have big hands, and I can't use my iphone 17 now without two hands. This is even wider before unfolding.
Who wants bigger phones? Who is like, "damn I wish I had a tablet that I could fold up and still barely fit in my pocket"?
I want smaller phones. The width of the iPhone 4 was nearly perfect imo. If they would take modern display technology with approximately that width and expand it to 16:9, I think it would kill, even if it were relatively underpowered compared to the modern top of the line.
I wrote a long comment about how this product does not make sense, but I changed my after having written it. There are some overlap with the iPad and I thought that this might compete with that, but I no longer believe that.
Here is why, and why I personally believe this product might be great.
I will never carry an iPad when I am out and about. If I am going to carry a device of that size, I will bring a laptop. The only use that I personally have for an iPad is laying in my couch or using it as a stationary device for a baby call or something like this.
In this scenario, the bigger screen size is nice.
I often find myself on the go, wanting a larger size screen to deal with random incoming stuff, accountant, customer issues, PRs, and so on. In those cases, it is very handy to have a larger screen. I can manage with my current screen size, but it would definitely be more productive with a larger screen.
I am personally worried about the reliability of the mechanical parts, and I would be really annoyed if the screen started to crease, as I have seen similar devices do before. But if Apple somehow magically fixes that problem, then I would be inclined to buy a product like this for my next phone purchase.
Oh wow.
That looks extremely boring and unexciting. It doesn’t look like it’s Apple, it looks like Xiaoco Fold Z Duo 16.
Just a reminder to everyone, always buy the second version of any new product category, even from Apple. The first duo will look primitive in a few refresh cycles. It does look really cool though!
It actually looks really nice; and I'd consider myself their target demographic conceptually. My last iPhone was a Pro for context.
But at a $2K starting price, plus likely another $200 for the storage size they really expect people to purchase, in this economy, it is so far outside of my price range it is dead to me.
Which is to say: Cool tech, but I've already dismissed it as something I want evaluate for my next phone just based on price alone.
That's maybe the real death-nail for folding phones: Price hasn't yet shifted to allow them to be mass market rather than enthusiast phones.
I still don't get the fanfare over folding phones. They tend to be more fragile, and if I really need a larger screen, I'd much rather use a laptop or tablet.
That looks... horrible... I like the "calendar" mode, that's quite fun, but it looks way too wide when it's folded up, and a weird aspect ratio when it's open. Also they show putting the phone down on concrete half-open to take pictures, but that will scratch the outer screen, surely?
iPhace Duo https://news.microsoft.com/surfaceduo/
At some point these phones are powerful enough that we need to be able go get a desktop experience that can run macOS. Why is a 600 dollar neo more capable for productivity than a 2000 dollar iphone with a much beefier chip?
My wife's first question:
Will this fit in a woman's hand?
John Ternus, and his co-presenters, still presented with the now institutionalized Apple-voice: obviously-rehearsed, emotionally-flat, robo-replay.
They spent their time practicing to recite, instead of talk, to people.
So hard to sit through.
I had assumed that was a genuine, if not inspiring, reflection of Cook's controlled non-spontaneous personality. Relative to Steve's emotionally-rich casual-coded excited-to-share delivery.
I see some iPhone Pro Max buyers getting this simply because they paid around $1200 last year, then after trade-in ($885 for a 17PM), they could get into the Duo for $1,200.
If someone had that amount of disposable income last year, they might have it to throw at another upgrade this year.
Definitely a v1 product but it's an interesting device. Apple is rarely first to market, but they definitely produce the device that indicates the point where there is a market.
You can also see where they are going. In a couple of years, assuming it sells well there will be a Pro model with a 3x fold and better camera system. I'm guessing to make in thinner they will have to drop USB-C and come up with a flat charging/data connector. The EU won't like that.
The final interesting thing is this is the first Apple product that I can think of since the iPod era that they've released a product that will cannibalize another Apple product. If you were looking at getting a high end iPad Mini this replaces both phone and tablet.
$2,000 for a phone? Holy price point, Batman. No thanks.
I assume the people who would buy something like this have enough money not to care, and also would not care about the second part of my comment, because they want New Thing or use their phones enough for it to be useful.
I guess it might be the case that the only way to make the folding screen thing even remotely work is a very, very expensive manufacturing process. But as is often the case, I don't see how it's worth it?
I want my phones smaller and with Touch ID, not enormous and wrinkly.
This is an aside, but product websites are so clunky these days - they just constantly stutter, freeze and basically do not show off the product well because I'm waiting for stuff to happen. Make it smooth people!
Foldable gimmicks aside the new materials and components sound really cool. How they have the screen layers that move freely seems innovative. The new ceramic they’re using for the outer shell/screen sounds great and I hope we see it in more of their devices:
“Ceramic Shield 2 on the outer display reduces glare and provides 3x better scratch resistance than the previous generation”
I you can fit an iPad Mini in your pocket, you don't need a foldable display.
I hope the tri—fold format catches on (Huawei mate xt 1&2, Samsung z trifold).
If I’m going to carry around an insanely fragile and expensive device I want to maximise screen area and aspect ratio.
With some of what they showed, I wish they never separated iOS and iPadOS. The duo seems to be bringing more of the iPad features and if they could position this as one device to replace both (and the price point sure reflects that) it could be interesting.
But without that, I don't see the use for myself. Though I also rock a 13" iPad Pro so even with that it would be a hard sell to replace both.
I still am not sold on the entire idea of a foldable, there is some interesting things here and I will be interested to see how they position it over the next few generations.
I think the Duo looks great. And from the few hands on video I have seen I think the Apple presentation actually doesn't do it justice. There is no crease at all! [1]
On the note on this year's keynote. I can't be the only one who feels the whole vibe of the keynote changed. This isn't Tim Cook style keynote and John Ternus wasted no time to try and changed a few things already. I can't wait for John to further shake things up at Apple. But everything so far, all the small minor details suggest they are in the right direction.
[1] https://x.com/mweinbach/status/2097753099159138631?s=46