alt Hacker NewsAirbnb bans making guests do dishes and take out the trash
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I had two hosts cancel on me (last minute, both times around Christmas) and haven't dared to use Airbnb since (it was very inconvenient to find alternate accommodation last minute, to say the least.)
I understand that there can be exceptional circumstances. However, I've stayed in more hotels by a factor of at least 25, and this has never happened once. In fact, any minor inconvenience at a hotel is usually remedied promptly, and user reviews generally feel accurate.
Airbnb wouldn't share any information about why the host was allowed to cancel (I understand there may be privacy concerns, but I'm left wondering if they simply found a better paying private offer, given it was for the holiday season and booked well in advance). In one case I found an alternative in the same building, so there was no widespread issue.
Those two are enough to put me off Airbnb forever. I just don't want the additional stress of wondering whether I'll receive a last minute cancellation, even if they're exceedingly rare.
Contrarian view here but honestly I can't imagine not cleaning up after yourself by default. Of course I am not saying that I do a deep clean at every place I stay but if I'm staying in an AirBNB the very least I do is to leave the place in a civilised way. For example, if I use kitchen utensils I either clean them or put in the dishwasher when available. I seriously never understood people that just leave completely dirty things behind, especially when they are travelling with their kids.
My extended family rents a beach cottage for one week (saturday-saturday or sunday-sunday) every summer at a family oriented beach in North Carolina. We have done this at the same beach since the early 90s. There are local vacation rental agencies that have offered one week rentals with various packages of linens under similar terms and seasonal pricing for decades. Over the last few years, fewer and fewer houses are available directly from these rental companies and more and more are only listed on Airbnb or VRBO, with nightly pricing that is much higher than the weekly pricing from the local rental agencies.
The vacation rental companies offer very consistent cleaning services and local contacts for any issues with the house, and were relatively cheap because they were typically able to fill these houses with weeklong rentals all summer.
With Airbnb and VRBO, sometimes they are just a marketplace for the exact same rental companies that already existed, under the same terms and conditions, but a higher nightly price, and sometimes they are far less professional operations, and it's not easy to tell which is which when you are initially paying.
Last summer we rented a house directly through a vacation rental company that was also listed on VRBO for a third of the nightly price it was listed on VRBO for. We're dreading the day when the only option left is VRBO.
It's sad in a way because this is Airbnb finally abandoning its original "make money by renting out your couch" premise. The handful of remaining small-time hosts offering their actual residence are probably going to leave after these changes, and professionally managed short-term rental properties are going to complete their takeover.
I stopped using AirBnB altogether because of the rediculous cleaning rules and fees. Probably not going back but at least they're addressing it.
I found some hair in my Mariott bed sheets. I didn't think it was a big deal but decided to see if I could get fresh sheets. The hotel changed it at 9pm within 10 minutes. Offered me points. Apologized profusely.
What do you think would have been my experience at Airbnb?
There’s also been documented cases of owners using AI edited images to claim guests damage. Airbnb has a systemic cultural issue.
Thank god.
Call me lazy but I’ve always wondered why I need to take out the trash when a cleaning crew was coming in 10 minutes after I checked out.
I've been an Airbnb host for the last 3 years. We've never expected guests to do any cleaning or washing of dishes (although it's always appreciated when they do!) We charge a small cleaning fee to cover the costs of cleaning our studio which only takes an hour. We also have maintained a really high rating over the last few years (currently at 4.96). I would hope that other rentals that have ridiculous rules and high cleaning fees would suffer from average ratings?
I’d rather use Booking because I didn’t have to worry about doing chores for the hosts. It was a much better experience.
It's interesting how Airbnb has diverged from its original vibe of "staying at somebody's house." When I "stay at somebody's house" I wash the dishes, take out the trash, etc. Essentially, leave it as I found it, if not a bit better. I also expect "somebody's house" to be cleaner than a hotel.
Granted, Airbnb has taken on the hotel industry, and so I'm not surprised that their rules have evolved.
I'm certain that I've stayed in an AirBnB or two that had a rule book and chores, but I never read them. I'm a fairly tidy person and generally clean as I go, but I don't go out of my way to clean dishes or take out the trash unless it really needs it. I also don't leave reviews of places I stay, nor do I read the reviews left for me.
I don’t seem to have had all of the negative experiences that others here are reporting. Most of the recent places I have stayed have been clean and recently renovated. Usually the same or maybe slightly cheaper than a hotel room.
I once had to corner a guy trying to cut himself with a broken piece of mirror before he jumped off a second story balcony into the pool at a multi airbnb complex in Mexico. He'd taken some drugs and had a bad reaction and lost his mind. Cops picked him up running down the street.
I welcome this move to ban host rules that detract from the experience.
If I had places that would ask for a copy of my ID before giving me access codes to enter the place but wasn't mentioned on the listing. Also listed there was a kitchen but there weren't any plates or glasses... They charged $10 for bed linen etc. Also wasn't mentioned in the listing. AirBnB can be really annoying. Often they aren't cheaper than apart-hotels.
I've used Airbnbs for group trips only. The past few years, I have been leaning towards hotels for trips. But the newer hotels with the "open concept" bathrooms are not great for sharing a room with a friend. As a consumer, these changes puts Airbnb back in favor for me.
Airbnb illustrates two points really well:
1. Just like all the add-on charges with air travel like having a checked bag or choosing a seat, a lot of negative experiences come from consumers making decisions solely based on price. This creates an incentive to leave things out to have a lower sticker price. Hotels with non-optional "resort" fees, cruises, and car rental all operate on this model.
The specific issue with Airbnb is the supposed lower cost comes for hiding costs like cleaning. Cleaning is expensive when you start talking about an apartment let alone a house. This is built in to the hotel price (minus tips, which are minor). Also, hotels avoid having the potential for a lot of cleaning (eg a full kitchen).
You might stay in an Airbnb and never use the kitchen, existing totally on eating out. Or you might cook a full Thanksgiving dinner for 20 people and use every dish and appliance in there. How are you meant to handle this when the cleaning cost could be $100 or $1000?
2. Airbnb like oh so many "tech" companies profits by pushing the negative externalities of their business onto people who didn't consent. The most notable negative externality is running an illegal hotel in a residential neighborhood. Hotels have staff, fire codes, licensing and inspections. Some random house does not.
Another is that the house owner never has to suffer from disruptive behavior from guests who may never return. I really think more places should restrict Airbnb to ADUs only when the owner is on-site.
Also, the evidence that Airbnb has driven up rents is undeniable at this point with more than a decade of evidence.
At the same time, hosts clearly profit off of unreasonable charges, like charging $300-500 to "clean" a studio apartment that might only take an hour. It's a bit like landlords stealing security deposits. It's particularly egregious when you're given a random list of tasks you must do, such as stripping sheets and starting wash cycles, etc.
Intermediation businesses are generally bad. The only way to increase profits at a certain point is by cutting costs and raising prices. The other parties want to avoid the middleman charges and go direct. It's why all these businesses like finding cleaners, tutors, etc all only go so far because people go off-platform.
A classic race to the bottom. Both sides have bad actors, and that's why we can't have nice things.
I always much prefer a real hotel to AirBNB.
Enshitification at its best. I've used Airbnb almost since inception, but the degradation of offering quality has been so noticeable that I totally quit using this two years ago. Last time the host did not only ask me to do all house chores, and still charge a cleaning fee, but wasn't going to provide bed sheets without an extra fee (W(ho)TF thinks I'm renting and possibly coming with my own sheets), but didn't have the room officially ready until 5pm, and had me out at 10am. F*k this "industry"
These are all self-inflicted wounds by AirBnB. I have used AirBnB a few times in the past, but these days opt for a hotel instead if I can.
They could take user feedback seriously, but chose not to. Case in point: we booked a place in Hawaii. We (2 people) arrived the day of, tired as heck from the beach activities. Place looked fine, except for the crumbs of food in the nooks and crannies of the kitchen. No big deal. We crashed almost right away, too tired to do anything else. An hour later, my wife jumped up, claiming some insect was walking on her legs. I turned on the lights sleepily, and lo and behold, there were cockroaches on the ceiling, scurrying about (and one had fallen and landed on my wife's legs). In the middle of the night, I contacted AirBnB help. They wanted proof. So I took a video and sent it, along with photos. Finally around 2AM they agreed that we should get out of there. We packed up and left for the beach, to wait things out.
My first reaction was: I should leave a review telling people about the roaches. But guess what? AirBnB cancelled our reservation, so there was no way to rate the place or leave a review! They did refund me, but we wasted a day trying to catch up on the lost sleep.
After that experience, I stopped booking AirBnBs if I could help it. They (and VRBO) are a last resort for me (no pun intended).
Potentially unpopular opinion: The renting of short term residential property should be taxed at 15% of revenue. Digital advertising should be taxed at 20% of revenue.
The AirBnb model just fell apart with bad customer experiences. Customers want something closer to a hotel experience. The moment Airbnb started letting hosts treat guests like children doing chores they lost a huge chunk of the market.
It’s ultimately an issue of consistency. If I book with a name brand hotel I have some comfort knowing they have corporate standards that tend to be enforced consistently across properties. If a Hilton, Marriott etc hotel has issues it tends to get dealt with quickly because those brands know consistency is their brand. In extreme cases they will kick hotels out of their brand. That randomly named hotel that used to be a brand name was likely kicked out of the portfolio for compliance issues.
With an AirBnb it’s a total crapshoot. Sometimes it’s totally fine, other times you’d end up in the dirty lair of a psychopath.
"Airbnb" is a label that represents a massive range of situations. Different guests, different properties, different expectations.
I'm a host, I've had hundreds of stays over several years, and I have stellar reviews. It's a large house so there's a $250 cleaning fee. I ask guests to start the dishwasher and take their trash to the dumpster at the end of the street.
I'd say I have two types of guests. The first type is the 99% - they are friendly, grateful, and make the whole thing worthwhile. People who ask for recommendations on the area, leave a nice note in our guest book, and are grateful and respectful of our home. They never complain about taking care of a few things before they leave, and often ask what else they can do. It's honestly a source of positivity for everyone involved to have them stay in our home.
I can count on a single hand the number of times I've had the second type of guest. Exploitative people who have it out for us the second they check in and won't be satisfied until they've extracted money and apologies. As a host, I have literally zero recourse against these people. The system is set up to let them behave this way, and they make me more cautious and my home more expensive for everyone else.
Getting to my point - everyone comes to conversations about Airbnb with an enraged, polarized point of view. It's still a thriving platform with absolutely everything in a single place. The homes range from bare bones crash pads and neglected side projects to true luxury experiences. The guests range from people you are happy to have met to true predators.
Unfortunately, Airbnb and Vrbo have created an absolute race to the bottom. As a host I have next to zero ability to screen who stays with us, and I'm basically at the mercy of bad actors. They extract huge fees and are unhelpful to me and barely helpful to my guests. They introduce ham-fisted rules like this every few months and are revenue optimizing themselves off a cliff.
This is a market that could benefit from more choice.
I wonder if the bloom is coming off the Airbnb rose (probably not, because these kinds of things are always made a big deal of in tech forums but the company in question usually sees their revenue go up and up).
For me personally I only ever use Airbnb's now for big trips with at least 3-4 bedrooms needed. These types of Airbnbs usually have more professional management in any case. But otherwise I think Airbnb just offers a poor value:
1. For a long time Airbnbs skirted hotel taxes and other fees. Those days are long gone, so I often find Airbnbs to be just as expensive or more than hotels when you factor in cleaning and other fees.
2. Like this article points out, quality control and rules can be all over the map, and people are sick of it. With a hotel you usually know what you're getting, with an Airbnb it's always a crapshoot.
3. A huge benefit with a hotel is that if something goes wrong you can almost always be moved to another room, sometimes a different hotel. With Airbnb, while they may help you rebook it's much more fraught and you don't know what the next place will be.
So for me I use hotels for most stays now, though I am curious about house swapping for longer overseas trips. I have friends that have raved about it so it just seems like a better option.
I've never been a host but I can't see why this would be a problem that AirBnB should make a call on. I've travelled to places where they have different social norms and visitors should adapt to local culture.
Oddly this will probably let prices be raised, even though there's a cleaner usually there right after..
Most guests of AirBNB like clean homes, and usually tidy up pretty well themselves. Maybe there's a way to incentivize those who choose to, or want to and offer a discount if they want it.
Airbnb drives up the rents of residential neighborhoods to benefit rich travelers. YC needs to stop investing in these morally questionable businesses.
> Utilities: Guests shouldn’t be asked to avoid using a listed amenity like air conditioning, but you can ask them to turn it off when they leave.
Turn it off and come back to a sauna that will take 3 hours to cool down. I'm not doing that.
They were making guests wash dishes? That would've been a real problem.
My maid service will not wash dishes. They need me to clear the sink every time before they arrive. It's often a point of contention, because I leave dirty dishes quite often, and I simply forget what needs to be done. I don't have a problem with doing it for them, I just forget.
But I believe that the reason they will not wash my dishes is because of food safety. In a commercial kitchen, even the dishwasher needs to hold a Food Handler's card or certificate. The sanitizing of dishes and utensils is serious business. If they're not clean enough to eat from, you could be passing foodborne illness.
I would never want to stay at a place that didn't professionally wash its dishes. I've never stayed with AirBNB and I plan to keep it that way. Thankfully, the hotel industry is still a quite viable business, and hotels have staff, insurance, and regulation on their side, even now. I recently had a "staycation" in a 98-year-old classic hotel, and it was so wonderful, worry-free, and pleasant, and cost-effective. I am thankful that they are still operating like that.
As a host, I feel like this issue is mostly just ragebait for TikTok. Same for the cleaning fee complaints (which has been gone for over a year but you still see ppl talking about it). There are absolutely bad hosts out there (I've dealt with it as a guest myself), but most hosts are totally fine and the guest review system absolutely works to filter out egregious behavior.
There's also quite a big perception bias towards guests when it comes to discourse about Airbnbs. As a host I have to deal with so many unbelievably disgusting and disrespectful people renting my places on a regular basis, but nobody is ever talking about that. Social media would have you believe all guests are victimized angels and hosts are greedy and evil. I would love to see some of these people host and find out what it's really like. If you've worked in retail or hospitality you know.
Airbnb has actually gotten extremely sensitive about this perception the last couple years. They've changed a lot of policies to bend over backwards for guests to avoid the PR. Anyone guest you see complaining online about a recent experience should be taken with a _large_ grain of salt because Airbnb very rarely sides with hosts anymore and it likely means the guest did something very egregious to get penalized.
My family uses Airbnb for every single holiday, has done for more than a decade, and have had a wonderful experience. Thank you airbnb!
Nickle and diming, thats the new MAGA.